Corpusfishing.com

TroutSlayer · Flour Bluffian in training Joined: 26 Aug 2008 Posts: 432

I did a long report on some stuff I got from TPWD about the health of trout in general as well as a look at the LLM to see if what they are doing there has produced any big benefits. The short version in my humble opinion is trout are doing great coastwide, there has not been a real gain seen in the LLM and we don't need limit reductions. It is just my opinions but if you take the time to read it (it is long) I guarantee you will at least know more about trout. If you ignore every word I say and just look at the pictures it is worth it.

My sources are TPWD who were outstanding in replying to requests, audio and transcripts of hearings, and newspaper articles. There is a source reference with links to everything. I have slides from PowerPoints they used and excel data. I am not trying to be a biologist and am far from it but we can all read charts and see high and low numbers. I think you will be surprised

here is a link to the pdf of the paper and lets keep it civil

http://rdonato.com/public/trout/TroutTruths.pdf
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CROAKERSOAKER · Flour Bluffian in training Joined: 16 Jan 2012 Posts: 491

Cool, to take time and learn more about what your interested in.
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speckled.trout · Full Grown Flour Bluffian Joined: 30 Aug 2012 Posts: 1190

Good job Randy, looks like you put a lot of time and effort into that report
and came up with some very useable information that everyone interested in our coastal fishery should look at.

ST

Rickxt23 · Pony Mullet Joined: 03 Aug 2012 Posts: 51

Great job. Thanks for taking the time ,very informative . Very Happy

HungerBuster · Flour Bluffian in training Joined: 07 Mar 2006 Posts: 371

Thanks for taking the time to put this together! Awesome!
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Shalor · Horse Mullet Joined: 28 Apr 2006 Posts: 180

Very interesting and well thought out paper and discussion. I would add to the confusion that there is evidence of significant trout migration between upper and lower Laguna Madre per trout tagging done by the Harte Institute. If trout are truly migrating in large numbers, I would think it makes it harder to determine the effectiveness of the decreased trout limit in the LLM. So my question would be are the ULM and LLM truly one system?? I don't think there is a definitive answer yet. Another curiosity question is why are they traveling so far?? I would guess food source, but who knows. I do appreciate the effort that went into your presentation.

TroutSlayer · Flour Bluffian in training Joined: 26 Aug 2008 Posts: 432

TroutSlayer · Flour Bluffian in training Joined: 26 Aug 2008 Posts: 432

They got dates and I will be in Africa when they do Corpus. I think it is sorta fast letting them out just now.
http://www.tpwd.state.tx.us/newsmedia/releases/?req=20131218a

All of the following scoping meetings will be from 6-8 p.m. on the dates shown:

Jan. 7, 2014, Port Lavaca: Bauer Community Center, 186 County Road 101
Jan. 8, 2014, Rockport: Aransas County Court Room, 301 N. Live Oak St.
Jan. 8, 2014, Corpus Christi: Del Mar College Center for Economic Development, 3209 S. Staples St., Room 106
Jan. 8, 2014, San Antonio: Lion
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redseeker1 · Joined: 06 Aug 2013 Posts: 4

Any more info on the San Antonio location?
Thanks

TroutSlayer · Flour Bluffian in training Joined: 26 Aug 2008 Posts: 432

Click the link. This forum software is flakey with copy paste
an. 8, 2014, San Antonio: Lion
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speckled.trout · Full Grown Flour Bluffian Joined: 30 Aug 2012 Posts: 1190

TroutSlayer · Flour Bluffian in training Joined: 26 Aug 2008 Posts: 432

I have to say I am really not happy with their online vote for trout reduction form. If anyone recalls last time we did this it was because the Middle coast really was going through a tough time. The changes were not implemented and TPWD said because the Middle coast had some really nice years that would put them back on track. I am paraphrasing here but the exact quotes are in the paper. Bottom line as predicted the middle coast got better and I at least think since 2010 the coast as a whole has improved. That was certainly the message in the last slide in the Nov. 6th 2013 presentation here it is.

OK so what has us needing change now? Here is a link to the form and I will then quote the disturbing part.
http://www.tpwd.state.tx.us/business/feedback/public_comment/proposals/201401_scoping_coastal.phtml

In my day job a Judge would sustain an objection for sure to a leading question that "supposes facts not in evidence" like this one:

The regulations within the LLM were instituted to stop and reverse the downward trend in overall abundance and spawning biomass in the region, and to ensure that fish reach larger size classes. The fishery in the LLM has benefited from these regulations. As these regulations have proven beneficial in the LLM, the department is considering expanding these regulations, or a variation thereof, to other areas along the coast

The form then asks if you support or not. How amateurish. Lets start with they assume I guess there is a trend that needs to be reversed. Where is it? Not in Robins slide because I like the trend and picture he paints. Then it states as fact the LLM has benefited. How can anyone who doesn't have detail data say no to that loaded question?

I urge you to let them know you really do not like loaded questions that assume facts.You can comment on the form below your vote. This question assumes a trend that needs to be reversed and assumes the LLM has benefits. See my paper and you decide.

If I seem sore it is this BS and the fact I am in Africa when the vote comes up here
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TroutSlayer · Flour Bluffian in training Joined: 26 Aug 2008 Posts: 432

Ok I want people to know what is going on. If you look up above and see the question they have for the survey it is clearly loaded and they know it. it basically assumes there was a trout health problem in the LLM and that reducing limits helped. I will not go into details of that debate as it is covered in the paper but the point is they are surely implying we have trouble on other coasts that can be fixed with reduced limits just like the LLM.

HOWEVER take a look at what they are saying in the FAQs Pay attention to the bold.

"Spotted Seatrout

What bay systems are considered as Upper Coast, Middle Coast and Lower Coast?
Upper includes Sabine Lake, Galveston Bay, and Cedar Lakes; Middle includes East Matagorda Bay, West Matagorda Bay, San Antonio Bay and Aransas Bay; Lower includes Corpus Christi Bay and the upper Laguna Madre. For the purpose of this discussion, lower Laguna Madre (LLM) is treated separately because of the special spotted seatrout regulations implemented in 2007.

What is the status of spotted seatrout populations in these regions?
In 2002, statewide spotted trout harvest regulations were changed to a 10-fish daily bag and 15-inch minimum size, with 1 fish over 25-inches allowed. Since implementation of these regulations, fishery independent sampling surveys from each of these areas indicate stable or slight increase in relative abundance of spotted seatrout. Recreational harvest from these areas has also showed increased landings with the exception of a drop in trout landings during the 2012-2013 season in the LLM.

Recruitment of spotted seatrout from each of these areas has remained relatively stable. The declines in relative abundance observed on the middle coast in 2009 were corrected with the high recruitment levels observed in 2010 and 2011. Recruitment levels in 2012 are consistent with levels from previous years, with the exceptions noted above for 2010 and 2011.

In 2007, special rules were adopted for the lower Laguna Madre (LLM) of which size limits were the same as the rest of the coast, but the bag limit was reduced to 5 fish. Since implementation of these regulations in the LLM, gill net surveys show that relative abundance has remained relatively stable though considerable year-to-year fluctuations occur. For example, the fall 2013 gill net catch rates are one of the lowest observed following one of the highest catch rates recorded from the spring 2013 sampling.

Are spotted seatrout overfished?
No. TPWD gill net, bag seine and harvest data indicate they are not overfished. Fishing pressure and landings are different for each bay, with some bays higher than others. Spotted seatrout are the most sought after species by anglers in Texas inshore waters, but the landings are currently at a sustainable level. A reduction in landings would increase the number of older and larger fish in the population.

Anyone else confused. Things look great so we need to reverse that trend?
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Drake · Posted: Fri Dec 20, 2013 9:53 am Post subject: Study

Good information, THANKS for taking the time to put it together.

Bayslammer · Posted: Mon Dec 23, 2013 11:38 am Post subject:

A reduction in limit would lead to larger trout landed. A reduction in limit would equal more trout. Less fish taken out means more trout left in. I am not a biologist, but it does not take a chart or graph to figure that out. Why can we only keep three reds, five drum but the trout stays 10? Ive attended scope meetings and my opinion means nothing, and honestly, the public opinion means squat. Everyone will base thier opinion on what best suits them. Personally, I think 10 trout per person is too many, and I would like to catch bigger trout more often. The powers that be will decide what will happen.... not the guy holding the meeting. He even says I will take this information back to Austin and they will do what they want regardless. It boils down to money and business is booming.
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